Author Topic: Barn find looking for advice  (Read 1006 times)

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Offline Garyuk

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Barn find looking for advice
« on: 21 Feb 2024 at 14:22 »
Hi I am new to this forum and also to Douglas motorcycles. I have owned and ridden other more modern makes for many years. While cleaning out the garage of a friend of mine who is a 91 year old compulsive hoarder I found this Douglas motorcycle buried under 6 feet of rubbish.
I think that it is a 1913 model O 2 3/4 side valve but I really need as much information as forum members can give me as I only know a little about Douglas bikes. The engine turns over freely as does the gearbox and it is possible to change gears. The bike has been there probably from the 1960's and the tax disc on the front is dated 1930. I also need to know what it would be worth as it is because I will very likely be selling it very soon.
I and it's owner would very much like to see it going to someone who can restore it to it's former glory. If you require any more info or photos please let me know.
Thank you in advance for your help.

Offline Doug

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #1 on: 21 Feb 2024 at 18:59 »
Frame and engine number date ranges can be found in the tables of this post:

https://www.douglasmotorcycles.net/aa-files/html/identify-part1/veteran3.6.htm

1913 would be in the range of 6940-125000, approximately. In this era, number locations would be as follows. The engine number is on the crankcase immediately above the rear cylinder base. The frame number is immediately above the transmission mount, though i cannot recall if it is on the left or right side.

-Doug


Offline cardan

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #2 on: 22 Feb 2024 at 01:25 »
There are a number of parts that suggest 1915-on (carb, CAV magneto...), but many Douglases scored a renovation at the end of WW1 and new parts went into the mix. As Doug says, engine, frame and gearbox numbers will tell. The frame number is usually on the gearbox lug adjacent to the pulley.

Leon

Offline Doogle

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #3 on: 23 Feb 2024 at 02:00 »
What a fabulous find, the patina is incredible and certainly suggests years of dry storage off the road. I'd be very interested if/when it does come up for sale if you could message me with some further details please? Thanks

Offline cbranni

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #4 on: 23 Feb 2024 at 08:03 »
I also would be very interested if it did come up for sale, it is a wonderful find and what we all dream of finding.

Regards Colin

Swansea

Offline Hutch

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #5 on: 25 Feb 2024 at 01:05 »
There are a number of parts that suggest 1915-on (carb, CAV magneto...), but many Douglases scored a renovation at the end of WW1 and new parts went into the mix. As Doug says, engine, frame and gearbox numbers will tell. The frame number is usually on the gearbox lug adjacent to the pulley.

Leon

Yes that is what it appears to be to me. Two "panel" paint job (which appears to be original) on veteran tank suggests circa 1919-20 manufactured tank? Single piece timing cover is post 1915, barrels don't have hole for priming cups suggesting post 1916. Rear stand mounts are hidden by the toolboxes (in a strange location) so hard to see if frame is pre or post 1914 but easy to verify either way. The only thing that draws the eye to suggest 1914 or earlier is the design of the carrier stays - which could have been replaced anytime.... I agree Leon, the frame / engine / gearbox numbers will tell the story but looks like a late ww1 / post war "restoration" to me - maybe performed by the factory or with parts supplied by the factory or maybe very late ww1 production bike?

- Great find BTW! :-) 

EDIT: Frame number above gearbox mount on right hand side of bike. Closer inspection of rear stand mounts in pictures seems to indicate a 1915 -1919 frame but hard to see.

Cheers

Hutch
« Last Edit: 25 Feb 2024 at 04:08 by Hutch »

Offline veikko1

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #6 on: 25 Feb 2024 at 19:38 »

Some notes: front forks is older type, and oil sight glass in petrol tank looks also older. Engine, (single timing cover and barrels) and exhaust pipe looks later??

Regards
veikko1

Offline Garyuk

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #7 on: 26 Feb 2024 at 15:09 »
Thank you to everyone for their help with this. After some hunting I managed to find the engine and frame numbers. The Date stamp on the engine casing behind the flywheel is 1918. The engine number stamped above the rear cylinder is 3/026 JFC 6193 and the frame number is 21209. photos below.















Photos aspect ratio fixed and closeups of numbers added - Dave, 27Feb2024
« Last Edit: 26 Feb 2024 at 18:53 by Dave »

Offline Garyuk

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #8 on: 26 Feb 2024 at 15:16 »
Oh and the tax ran out in September 1930, Don't think it's been on a sorn :) It cost the princely sum of 8 shillings and three pence at the time!

Offline cardan

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #9 on: 26 Feb 2024 at 21:35 »
21209 is a good frame number for 1915, which fits in with the "look" of the bike.

The "1918" stamped on the crankcase is also a Douglas thing: some dates were cast in, but some were stamped. The rest of the engine number is a bit of a mystery - there should be a 5-digit number stamped on the cases somewhere, perhaps under the years of muck on the top diagonal surface just near the numbers you have found. Anyway, if the bike was recommissioned in war time, or at the end of the war, no-one was paying too much attention to satisfying enthusiasts 100 years on.

It's a lovely thing; good luck finding it a home.

Leon

Offline cardan

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #10 on: 27 Feb 2024 at 02:59 »
A thread about renovation of wartime Douglases: https://www.douglasmotorcycles.net/index.php?topic=9218

Offline eddie

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #11 on: 27 Feb 2024 at 10:40 »
It begs the question, 'Is that really the engine number?' I can't find any other entries in the LDMCC machine register with that style of engine number! As the bike seems to consist of both pre 1914 and post 1914 parts, could it be one of the war time machines that were returned to the factory when hostilities ceased, to be refurbished and sold on to the general public? - in which case, could the quoted numbers be part of it's military identity, i.e. JFC - joint forces *****?.
  What ever the outcome, the quoted number doesn't conform to the usual style, and isn't in the expected position on the crankcase (on the mag platform, between the mag and rear cylinder).

  Regards,
               Eddie.

Offline Garyuk

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Re: Barn find looking for advice
« Reply #12 on: 29 Feb 2024 at 13:26 »
Hi Guys Just to let you know that this bike is now officially for sale. I will be posting soon in the "for sale" area of this site. I will be open to offers on this. Please pm me to arrange to view the bike. Based in Chipstead Surrey M25 junction 7.
Looking for someone who will restore it to the way it should be so for the moment I won't be posting it on Ebay or anywhere else, just here.
Thank you
Gary