WW1 douglas photo

[douglas-bg]

Hello Douglas experts,

I want to ask for help about one photo. I know the angle is crazy and hard to recognize. But if anyone with sharp eye for Douglas motorcycles recognize this motorcycle as Douglas.? Picture is taken in 1928. But in my opinion is 1913-1915 Douglas.

Thank you in advance.

Best regards
Valentin

[EW-Ron]

Do we know where this pic is likely to have been taken. ?

That small lamp looks more electric than acetylene ?
And those front forks have a distinct loop looking structure to them ?

Given how far into Europe this may be, is something like an FN or Peugeot likely to be possible ?
It still looks new and shiny if its 10 years after WW1 ?
That front tyre looks well travelled though.

[douglas-bg]

Hello Ron, the photo is taken in Bulgaria at the end of 1920's.

[EW-Ron]

Is this likely to be a Bulgarian Army chap on an army motorcycle ?
And that is a sidecar beside him ?

The military usually take great pride in their history, would the motorised division have
a history unit which may have old photos of their history ?
Often some barracks somewhere will have a history unit, and maybe even a small museum
with such stuff gathered together ?

[douglas-bg]

Hello Ron,

This is not photo from Bulgarian army. In World War 1 we have very very few motorcycles - and they were manly NSU and Wanderer. In this period we have a strong cavalry, probably the last time in history when cavalry was used. In 1914-1919 period we have not more than 10 motorcycles in Bulgarian army. I work on a book on this thema and I'm often visitor of National military archive. This is deffinetly not military motorcycle.  Until the end of WW1 in Bulgaria have not more than 20 motorcycles in whole country. Just like happened all over the world, WW1 became fire starter for motorcycling. Many people who don't have money for courses were trained for free by the different armies. And after the war this trained motorcyclists got chance to buy cheap military motorcycles. This happened in Bulgaria too. Some motorcycles came as war trophies, other were sold by different armies on the balkans. Because for them is cheaper to sell them to local armies than to transport them back to Great Britain or France. This bikes were sold by Bulgarian army after the war because we got many reparations to pay and we have very limited military stuff. This motorcycles became in hands of bicycle racers and they became good soil for start organizing motorcycle sport in Bulgaria. Mostly Triumph H and BSA H and K. Also some 1916 Bianchi C75, 1914 Sarolea 4 hp, 1915 Douglas 2 3/4. This WW1 motorcycles were used until late 1920's than were replaced by new machines most of the time BSA, ARIEL, TRIUMPH.

The sidecar that you see is atached to Triumph Ricardo from 1924 it is not attached to the motorcycle I asking for. It is group photo of 3 motorcycles. 2 of them with sidecars - 1928 Triumph N De Luxe and 1924 Triumph Ricardo both with what it look to be Gloria sidecars. And the third bike is the one I asking for. I think it is not FN nor Peugeot, because they use different type of front fork. This is definetly something like Druid front fork.

Best regards
Valentin

[cardan]

Hi Valentin,

I could come up with a pretty long list of what it isn't, but that's useless without some suggestions about what it is. The inverted U on the front fork - together with no glimpse of springs - made me think Puch, but I'm not convinced. Pity we can't see how the wheel mounts on the fork.

I think you have the early date correct: the handlebars on a stem look quite wartime or maybe early 1920s. Continental, I think.

Cheers

Leon

[douglas-bg]

Hello Leon,

Thank you very much for your answer. I think you nailed it. I think for 1910's NSU but I don't see any central spring. I think for Druid front fork but don't see the lower mounted springs. I don't see any fork springs at all. So I think you are very much correct. It must be Puch. Once again thank you very much for your answer.

Kind regards
Valentin

P.S.
Apologies to moderators that it is not Douglas, but at first I think about this brand because the levers on the handlebars. If they think this is the wrong place for my qustion please delete it or move it to other section of the forum.

[cardan]

Hi Valentin,

I'm not entirely sure that I have nailed it, but it could be Puch. Images below show their sprung fork first seen around 1912: everything other than the inverted U is fixed, and the U and its legs slide up and down, presumably with coil springs inside. The 1916 Model TR has foot boards like the bike in your photo, plus similar handlebars and levers.

The photos come from Libor Marcik's lovely book "Motorrader Osterreich-Ungarn 1899-1918". Beautiful to look at; pity I can't even say for sure what language it is written in!

If not Puch, it could be something Puch-inspired. I wonder if Bulgaria had good trade with Austria after the first war.

Cheers

Leon

[Doug]

Apologies to moderators that it is not Douglas, but at first I think about this brand because the levers on the handlebars. If they think this is the wrong place for my qustion please delete it or move it to other section of the forum.

Will move to the "Kingswood Pub" board when the discussing has run its course.

-Doug