Author Topic: Douglas mudguards, Models RA, OW, OB, OC, 600EW, S5/S6/T6, Aero500/600 (Read 16190 times)

Doug · « **on:** 08 Oct 2013 at 23:40 »

I am trying to determine if there is significant interest in mudguards rolled to the following profile:

An order is being quoted for various RA projects, but the same profile is also used on the OB/OW models, OC, 600EW/F28 models, and the S6/S5/T6 models. I anticipate it to be expensive, as expected for a limited production of a special profile. I would not be surprised if they run to $150US a mudguard. But at the moment, all I am looking for is a a level of interest, not pre-orders. If there is interest I will get some extras made and try to sell them to get the cost per mudguard down.

The LDMCC had a very small batch of these made years ago, but I do not think they have been available since.

-Doug

Chris · « **Reply #1 on:** 09 Oct 2013 at 09:01 »

Hi Doug
As mentioned in my personal to you email I am also interested in a pair of these mudguards for my OB restoration and would also consider replacement of the virtually scrap mudguards I have restored for my S6. In case this posting restores memories, I was informed in discussion with a member in the Sydney area last year that a batch of mudguards to this section had been procured in the past from an Asian source. These were reported to have been of excellent quality and cheap. In fact it was stated that they wished they had purchased more of them. Subsequent searches for the source have not been able to recall details.
As you mentioned above I was informed on good authority that a batch had been procured by The LDMCC some years ago from a company in the UK. It was further added that a sample/samples had been supplied to the firm that were never returned. Investigations have failed to find any trace of these samples and current efforts within the UK, including with a successor company to the original supplier, have failed so far to reproduce these sections by conversion of standard sections. The solution is claimed to be manufacture of new purpose designed rollers which would be very expensive and has not so far been considered economic in view of the small orders. If a world wide requirement can be established this might be economically viable. In the meantime I await with interest the quotation from your selected proposed supplier.
Chris.

cardan · « **Reply #2 on:** 09 Oct 2013 at 09:14 »

Hi Doug,

I guess you know we have a guy out here in Australia who could likely make these for a reasonable price - shipping around the world is incredibly expensive these days now that sea mail has disappeared.

Are the guards for the RA (28" wheels) and those for the OB etc (26" wheels) the same, or do they have different radii?

Leon

Alan Cun · « **Reply #3 on:** 09 Oct 2013 at 09:56 »

Hello All,

Years ago I was contacted by a chap (Melb I think) who had made a contact with a sidewalk tradesman who could make some CW mudguards in Indonesia. I put in an order for six and the quality I thought good. The edges were folded not wired. Not sure why but my contact said that was all he would be importing. Can't remember the price but they were cheap.

Maybe someone holidaying in an Asian country may be able to source a manufacturer.

regards Alan

graeme · « **Reply #4 on:** 09 Oct 2013 at 11:24 »

The Asian mob were called Madan Services (presumably from Madan in Indonesia), and they had an agent in Australia who advertised in Just Bikes - about 10 years ago. No sign of them since, but the guards were good and cheap. We got 2 pairs made - and indeed should have ordered more! They also supplied head light shells - a friend ordered one for a Velocette and it was nicely made. The finish on the outside was smooth but the inside showed that the whole thing had been hand beaten! Cheap labour obviously

Chris · « **Reply #5 on:** 09 Oct 2013 at 12:20 »

Good point Leon re radius of wheels. If the radius of guards is different for 28" as opposed to 26" wheels then I would require them for the smaller radius.
Is it true that sea mail has now ceased? it is less than a year since I received a petrol tank sent back from Australia to UK via sea mail. That was expensive enough; I shudder to think what airmail costs would be for mudguards.
Chris.

Doug · « **Reply #6 on:** 10 Oct 2013 at 13:43 »

Chris, Leon,

Research indicates regardless of wheel size, they were all using a mudguard radius of 15-1/16 to the crown. Getting a quote from the fella in Melbourne that rolls mudguards for the early Indians and Harley Davidsons.

International surface post disappeared many years ago from the American scene. Most of the so called surface post was being loaded into commercial airline flights or sublet out to FedEx aircraft fleet, so they just dropped the surface option and raised the prices to suit. With the advent of checked baggage fees and the shift to cramming everything into the overhead lockers, there is plenty of hold space to sell to the bulk shippers!

I was still getting incoming shipments that indicated surface post was in effect for other countries, but I suppose they have all been going the same route and eliminating surface post from their offerings.

My experience with Asian manufacturing for prototypes is the you never quite get what you specify on the drawing. And if you do not specify it, your expectations as to what is normal acceptable tolerance or finish and their idea of normally acceptable tolerance and finish are miles apart. If you are there or have a representative on the spot to ensure you are getting what you want, it can be a very good value. However they do not seem to get the idea that you would be willing to pay them to do twice as good a job, and it would still be cheaper than having it made domestically. But if you are having it shipped in and the first time you see the goods is when you are opening the box/crate, there is limited recourse. So no, I am not interested in checking out manufactures in Asia, but if someone else is, have at it.

By all accounts the fella in Melbourne has a very good reputation for quality.

-Doug

aphex · « **Reply #7 on:** 10 Oct 2013 at 19:28 »

Hi, Doug,
If you are considering to go for a small batch , you can count me in for a rear mudguard for my S6.The one that is on my bike is an original one that have been cut in two ,so it would be easy to remove the rear wheel , nice but factory build i would think.

Let me know something,
Regards ,
Sven

cardan · « **Reply #8 on:** 10 Oct 2013 at 22:41 »

Hi Doug,

Yell if I can help at the Australian end. No doubt I will see Adam in person at the Bendigo Swap Meet next month.

Leon

ste · « **Reply #9 on:** 12 Oct 2013 at 06:06 »

I need a pair of TS ones if anyone is making them?

Stephen

Doug · « **Reply #10 on:** 12 Oct 2013 at 13:15 »

Stephen,

Sorry, these mudguards would not be the correct profile for the TS. You could try an advert in the Douglas Parts Wanted section.

-Doug

Chris · « **Reply #11 on:** 13 Oct 2013 at 10:28 »

Hi Doug
One of my friends has also expressed interest in a rear mudguard for his S6.
Chris.

tck · « **Reply #12 on:** 20 Oct 2013 at 09:15 »

Re Asian remakes
My close knowlege of replacement tanks bears out the above comments I have many stories of petrol tanks all skilfully made but just not quite correct the lug positions petrol tap and other holes were always just in the wrong place. So frustrating! and of course if you were to supply a jig or guage the market would be flooded with direct sales.
You need to spend the first day of the holiday sorting it out and the last day collecting in person.
me? no thanks, its outside the baked bean belt, I would die of deli belly before I got home.

Dirt Track · « **Reply #13 on:** 22 Oct 2013 at 04:58 »

G'day all.
Doug
Could you please place my name on the list for a pair.
Let me know when you need the money.
All the best.
Howard.

Jonathan · « **Reply #14 on:** 23 Oct 2013 at 10:48 »

Hi all,
I too need a pair for my S6 project.
Please count me in. Let me know how much and where to send the money.
I will be at Bendigo swap, but assume they won't be ready by then.
Regards
Jonathan

Doug · « **Reply #15 on:** 25 Nov 2013 at 20:57 »

Update-

I have done a survey of six original mudguards dating from a 1928 600EW, a T6, and a 1936 & '37 Aero600, and came up with four that had a radius of 2-7/16" and two a radius of 2-1/2" to the outside of the crown (which means the inside radius is a little smaller yet). So despite Douglas dimensioning the drawing a 2-9/16" to the inside, what they actually delivered was something different. The reason this is important is tooling for a inside radius of 2-7/16" already exists, which would mean a considerable savings in the setup charges. Otherwise a set of new rolls would have to be commissioned at over $2k.

The radius falls right in the range of what I am seeing on original mudguards, so I am proposing we take advantage of the existing tooling. For the RA these can be supplied with the rear guard trapped to clear the chain. But since the same profile fits so many other models it is proposed to get blanks made that can be made up into whatever desired, front or rear. This also applies to the front of the RA, as there has been some variation seen in how the factory dealt with squeezing a nearly six inch wide 'guard between girders only about four inches apart. Everyone will have their own ideas about what is authentic.

There is still investigation ongoing as to what, then, the mudguards will cost. Watch this space.

-Doug

cardan · « **Reply #16 on:** 26 Nov 2013 at 10:20 »

I think the proposed size will be close enough, for me at least. I spoke with Adam at Bendigo Swap and he seemed enthusiastic. I'm happy to try the prototype pair. The back guards on an RA (for example) are very long.

Leon

balintka · « **Reply #17 on:** 03 Dec 2013 at 20:53 »

Hi Doug,

Please write my name too to your list for a pair of mudguard.
(For my T6 project.)
Thx a lot.

balintka

Austinpike · « **Reply #18 on:** 21 Dec 2013 at 16:21 »

Doug
Please count me in for a pair on my project S6

Regards

Simon UK

Doug · « **Reply #19 on:** 22 Dec 2013 at 03:05 »

Waiting to hear back from 'the man with the rollers' about rolling a test sample.

-Doug

Thomas Evans · « **Reply #20 on:** 21 Aug 2014 at 07:26 »

Yes please....

Doug · « **Reply #21 on:** 05 Feb 2016 at 03:38 »

Well, After a very long wait, some mudguards have been rolled. The original plan was to get a test pair rolled and inspected, then solicit pre-orders for a batch production. The start date kept getting pushed back and back, so that when the fella finally did make a start and wanted to run of a small lot of a dozen only, it was agreed just to get something in hand. Most of these have been delivered to ongoing RA projects, though I have not yet seen them myself to pass my own judgment on the accuracy and quality.

Oddly, the supplier only wanted to run a small quantity, even though we were able to show a respectable demand through replies to this post and PMs received on the subject, and that it would be based on pre-orders (with perhaps a few extra on speculation). Instead, he wanted tool up again to run a larger batch (possibly) mid-year 2016. Given that it took two years to get the first few, I would not get too excited about that date. It may be that other work in the queue was such that he could not commit the time to a large run at present.

So unless some of the other recipients want to chime in on the quality of the received mudguards? It may be a month or so before mine are shipped. But as for getting more made and when, I do not know. It has been frustrating getting this far.

-Doug

Dirt Track · « **Reply #22 on:** 05 Feb 2016 at 03:43 »

G'day Doug.
What is the cost involved nowadays including postage?
Young Howard.

Austinpike · « **Reply #23 on:** 05 Feb 2016 at 05:35 »

Doug
Count me in if there are any spare for my S6, please let me know the costs

regards

Simon (UK)

PS still looking for a S6 fuel tank .

RA23 · « **Reply #24 on:** 05 Feb 2016 at 10:07 »

Doug has pretty much told the story. In November 2013 armed with a drawing supplied by our G M Uncle Doug from Obama Land en route to Melbourne to meet up with Leon at Jack Nelson's ( doyen of OHV Douglas ) to breathe in some OHV Douglas and Norton fumes a pre arranged visit to Adam Higgins was made to organize a batch of guards.I knew it would likely be a long wait I had given thought to machining the three formers required but as luck would have it Adam had factory drawings and the formers for Rudge guards. Keeping in mind CNC machining would cost upwards of $2000.00 or countless hours, or weeks on my Colchester Triumph 2000, material being 200 mm diameter 200 mm long,. Adam was pretty convinced with a bit of adjustment he could give us the guards using the formers on hand. I didn't ask for a price and said I have come early so as to give you time ,knowing he has a backlog of work. Time dragged on I touched base every now and then and I know he had dramas but September last he rang and thanked me for my patience and said finally he had them spot on and they arrived within the week. Leon has his I have sent a pair to Martin in Austria Dougs are crated up ready to fly next week. I emailed the two mentioned and said if they were to close their eyes and caress the full curve of these guards it may well bring on multiple orgasms, Martin suggested wearing a diaper Doug was horrified at the thought of staining these beautiful smooth shiny objects. To Adam we offer our thanks they are beautiful almost too pretty to paint and certainly well worth the wait The bad news is he not likely to do a big batch for some time , he said 6-9 months I think somewhat longer but I have told him there has been a lot of interest on the forum so it will be his decision, as to when he has the time to do so with the on going volume of other orders,
Leon, Martin Doug ( sorry about the stains Doug ) and myself are very happy chaps. It is true that good things come to those who wait. Sorry to the rest of you I did try hard to get a lot more done but the ball is in Adam's court at this time.
Bob Barlow ( RA 23 )