Picture of 1917 Douglas Fleet

[Frank Lyn]

While looking through an old Magazine, I came across this picture of a fleet of Douglas.  Given that they sold over 20,000 to the British Military, such scenes should not be infrequent.

[tommiesguides]

Its interesting but I am not sure it will reproduce ok because it's newsprint. Photograph or postcards tend to be better, sorry!

[tommiesguides]

 An interesting shot, shows the value that was put on despatch riders!

[arturro]

Dear Friends
Please find some photos with military bike and riders from my collection. I hope it is what you need.
Best regards Artur



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[cardan]

Nice photos Artur -
[edit now that photos are separate and right way up]
top photo: Rudge Multi c1915-16
next photo: left to right - unidentified (I thought it was BSA when it was sideways), BSA, Douglas
next photo: Zenith Gradua (note the famous tram handle, wound to change the belt ratio - opens the front pulley flanges and slldes the rear wheel back to keep the belt tension constant)
lowest photo:  P&M (two-speed primary drive by chain, chain final drive, used mostly by the RAF in the war)

Note that the lone Douglas is 1912-pattern, with the inlet manifold held on by a single bolt into the port (rather than the 1913-on design with screw-on rings).

Leon

[cardan]

Looking again at the photo of three bikes, I can now see that the bike on the left is a Zenith Gradua. It's much the same as the bike in the third photograph, but there are a number of minor differences so it is unlikely to be the same bike.

Leon

[Hutch]

Thanks Artur, Frank, Ryan and Leon for the interesting pictures and comments on dispatch riders, particularly interesting to me as I am in the process of restoring a 1915 2 3/4 (Leon of course you already know this  )

Some more pictures of dispatch riders can be found on the Australian War Memorial Website in the "Lost Diggers of Vignacourt" collection. This collection of glass plate negatives featured on television here in Australia a year or two back.

https://www.awm.gov.au/exhibitions/remember-me/collection/?search=&units=All&subjects=76


cheers

Ian

[cardan]

Lovely photos - most evocative. I see a few 2 3/4s, a nice 3 1/2 outfit, but the rest are Triumphs. All but one of these are the Model H with the Sturmey Archer CS gearbox. The exception is the first bike, which is a 1914 model with a Sturmey Archer 3-speed hub in the back wheel, just an over-grown version of the famous bicycle hub.

Then there's the alien: half Triumph, half Douglas if I'm not mistaken: https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/p10550.662 Perhaps not "half" Douglas, but the front fork looks like 3 1/2 Duggie to me.

(Ian - I raided a friend's shed last weekend for 2 3/4 wheels and came away with 4 wheels and a hub. I'll try and sort through them at the weekend and let you know what's there.)

Leon

[Hutch]

Thanks Leon for the info on the wheels and hub, I will await  your reply after the weekend! . There is a facebook link on the website for the collection which present the photo's in a different format and I found this




which explains a little bit about how the collection was obtained for the museum. I seem to remember from the TV documentary that there were in fact many more negatives than these, but some were lost (?). It was very fortunate that these were saved.

Cheers

ian

[Hutch]

Here is what appears to be a 1915 Douglas from the same photographer as the Vignacourt ones ? (looking at the props in the background), but I haven't found it in the war memorial collection. I found this in a ebay advert some time ago, but cannot find it again!

Ian

[olesuffolkbuoy]

This is like having a photo of the wife and children together - the two loves of my life - Rudge & Douglas!
Unlike Douglas, Rudge was not blessed with any UK military orders for bikes and had to make do with a single order from the Russian army.
So, I wonder if this lad is posing on his own machine?
Upon closer inspection, the Multi has 'Rudge' cast into the crankcase mouth so that makes it a veteran and likely a pre-war build.
It also sports the new foot operated oiling pedal as used by Pullin to win the '14 Senior TT and these were fitted to production machines after that success.
The filler cap also looks like the square, flip-top type as fitted to racing machines and not the normal screw on cap.
So, maybe our Serviceman engaged in a bit of competition work at the weekends?

Have been looking for one of those lovely round leather hat boxes to carry my spare belt in for ages!

Wonderful pictures - thank you.

Tony

[cardan]

Dangerously good taste Tony! Rudge updated their features almost continuously, so the Multi in the image is certainly 1914 or later. You mention the foot-operated oiler near the front footrest, said to have been first used by Cyril Pullin (there's a famous Douglas name - 100 mph on his "S1" in the early 1920s) on the Rudge he developed for the 1914 TT. The first of these (in a mid-year catalogue Pullin won the the May 1914 TT) was a smaller oiler (and brake) pedal, and the side plates for the forward footrests were rather skeletal. The bike in our photo has solid sides to the footrests and the larger pedals, so I'd date it as a "1915 model" or later. Rudge presented a brand new 1915 Multi to the Science Museum, and it has these pedals and footrests. Re the square flip-top fillers: I would have said that the entire Rudge range used these from mid-1914 on, except that the Science Museum bike has a screw-on cap! The lesson is that not all bikes are ever exactly to catalogue spec. Period catalogues make no mention of choice of filler caps.

Now, back to Douglas before we get into trouble!

Leon

[graeme]

I reckon you're on the money with those forks Leon - definitely not Triumph!