Valuations

[Dave]

Recently we had a less than gratifying experience after I posted a request from a non-member for identification and valuation of an engine which unknown to some of us, had already been listed on Ebay.

We’ve had a few requests for valuations in the past, however this engine topic illustrated the delicate nature of providing a valuation to anyone who requests it.

For any marque to survive and grow in popularity, the question of “how much is it worth?” will keep arising. And here in the Douglas Forum, we will continue to receive our share of requests. We can either duck for cover and wait until the topic gets buried. Or we can take a more proactive role and perhaps create a more satisfying experience for all concerned.

Up to this point, there’s been no guidelines for valuations in our Forum. People ask and they may or may not receive an answer. We have the Ebay forum (viewable only by members) which was created to record significant Douglas transactions on Ebay. However, not all Douglas sales are recorded – only when a member makes the effort to post. Also, as a child forum of the Douglas For Sale forum, it’s not very prominent – certainly to visitors who can’t see it at all.

Perhaps it’s time we created some guidelines, or an agreed procedure, so that requestors know what to expect from us – whether we will make valuations or not. If not, perhaps we could offer some information on how to research your own valuation. If we do decide to help, we could advise what information they need to provide, what they may expect from other Forum Members and hopefully teach them how to say “thanks”!

This topic has been started with that in mind. It’s a place for anyone who has thoughts on the subject of valuations to post them here. If you are an experienced Douglas owner, or a newcomer to the Douglas world, this is the place to express what you think about whether/how valuations should be conducted in our Forum.

The end result of our discussion could be as simple as a topic explaining how to research your own valuation, plus our views on the subject. All valuation requests could be referred to this topic. Or at the other end of the scale, it could be a separate Valuations forum especially for valuation discussions and where requestors must provide certain information and photos.

To kick off discussion, here are a few points for consideration…

1.   Should we provide valuations at all?
2.   Could the Ebay Forum be improved so it’s a better guide to values?
3.   Should requestors have to be a member and post the valuation request him/herself?
4.   What details and information should be posted about the item?
5.   Should we have a special Valuations forum (members only?) so they’re all in the one place like the Ebay forum
6.   What about photographs – are they essential?
7.   The location of the machine/parts?
8.   Is the item(s) for sale now?
9.   Do you plan to offer it for sale in the next X months?
10.   Should it be a condition that it is offered here in our Douglas For Sale forum first or simultaneously with any external listing?
11.   Advice on how to respond to valuations (eg say “thanks”) could be given

This isn’t a complete list of possibilities – just a few to get things started. Any ideas, comments, suggestions - no matter how minor - are most welcome.

Dave

[Ian]

Dave, I don't have an issue with "valuations" per se - they are only our personal opinion. I think if a regular contributor to the forum wants something then no problems. I do think that for new people who come on we should expect that if the item is offered for sale we at least know about it !! A better approach would be that if people want to get a valuation for something they want to sell then they let the market decide by offering it for sale - offers invited - on this forum !!

[eddie]

Dave,
          I go along with Ian in that any valuation can only be a personal opinion. Also, location has a great influence on those values - members from the UK who attended the Australian Centenary Rally were amazed that Dragonflies fetch as much money as 2¾'s in Aus. Here in the UK, those of us who have been associated with the marque for many years, still only consider them to be worth about 7s/6d (old English money) - we still can't get our heads round the fact that, these days, they are valued in the 1000's of Pounds.
        Getting on to the fact that there was some ill feeling following the postings about that DT engine - any contributor who is not prepared to be 'transparent' enough to furnish some personal details, should, in my opinion, be ignored. The members of this forum seem to drop into 2 categories - those of us who enjoy the ownership and use of our Douglas motorcycles (and foster that enjoyment via this website), and those who just enjoy the money that can be generated from them!
        This superb website is here for the benefit of the true enthusiasts - lets keep it that way. Here's looking forward to more 'healthy' discussion!
                                      Regards,
                                                     Eddie.

[bear640]

- any contributor who is not prepared to be 'transparent' enough to furnish some personal details, should, in my opinion, be ignored. The members of this forum seem to drop into 2 categories - those of us who enjoy the ownership and use of our Douglas motorcycles (and foster that enjoyment via this website), and those who just enjoy the money that can be generated from them!
        This superb website is here for the benefit of the true enthusiasts - lets keep it that way. Here's looking forward to more 'healthy' discussion!
                                      Regards,
                                                     Eddie.

I totaly agree with you about personal details Eddie. 
Even though I dont have alot to say on this site, I sit back & read hoping to increase my knowledge of old bikes. Most members here have probably forgotten more about Douglas bikes than I know.
Me being in my early 40,s ,,, i just wished the 'historic bike bug' bit me 20 years earlier.

[trevorp]

i think that we have a huge data base of sales on ebay, people can make their own mind up, and the big killer is condition, pictures quite often dont tell the whole story, i think we should only value, by pm or email and not on the site for the public to see as something is only worth what someone is willing to pay, an then only as a member giving advice
we have a, for sale system maybe, we open that part of site to non members so anyone can sell or buy or advise to put on ebay
ive been a bit slack with the ebay stuff latley as i used to do some of the input and alwyn used to do the rest





i wonder though the parts that say in australia no one wants, may end up in a dumpaster somewhere, and wonder if a douglas club in australia may not be a bad idea rasie some money and buy parts to keep the marque alive we wont have bikes if we dont have parts

[eddie]

 buy parts to keep the marque alive we wont have bikes if we dont have parts


[/quote]

That has always been the aim of the LDMCC spares schemes. We value highly the products of the Hanham Road factory and the spares schemes are there to keep the Douglas machines running - it has never been our aim to make it possible to produce 'New' Douglases from spare parts. We are doing our best to make sure we keep the Marque alive.
                                  Eddie.

[Michael Scott]

Hallo all
Much good stuff has been said already. I believe that a valuable and interesting service could be provided but as a minumum we need:
Complete transparency
An understanding that everything is based on opinions and these have different "values" to each "reader"
Photos can be misleading but no image is worse.

I have been a very active Vincent Owners Club member and the VMCC for the last seven or eight years and club nights and rallies are often dominated by talk of prices for parts, projects and complete bikes.  The discussions often include scorn and derision and are huge fun.  If we can maintain such an open approach and continuously watch for the dangers of dogmatic statements we can add further value to great forum.

ps This forum has been extremely helful in getting my 1930 S6 on the road and with a few miles under my wheels I am off to the Banbury Run in a ride and restore condition.
Michael

[Douglas52]

Evening All

Michael is fairly much on the money (hehe) in my opinion.

This forum offered considerable help and insight when I asked posted a request ( ref -  1914 Douglas - Originality and Price). You guys prevented me making a mistake by pointing out the differences between the advertisement title and the photos.

In my opinion the valuation is secondary to the description of whats actually for sale.

I know we all hate the parasitic element associated with old bikes (i.e. those who misrepresent and those who drive prices up by adding no value but onsell at a higher asking price).

Perhaps, critical review and commentary  on enquiries might actually assist in levelling the playing field, while providing the rest of us with useful information.

Regards

Steve McKenzie

[Dave]

Thanks to all for your comments. I’ll try and roll them all into a single post for reference by people seeking a valuation in the future.
Any further comments welcome.

Dave